The Expert Podcast

If you're watching this video channel, it's probably because you have a vehicle that needs a title, you have title problems, or maybe you're just an auto enthusiast that has run into vehicles without titles. We're going to talk about different ways of getting a title and why some of the common ways people go about getting a title really aren't that good. There are really only two ways you should try to get a title for a vehicle when you don't have the old title.

What do you mean by the old title? Well, a vehicle title, as you know, is a legal government document. It looks like this. It's not a blank sheet of paper you could buy from a company; it's actually a physical certificate, and it evidences not only the vehicle itself but also who the owner is. On that title, it is listed who the legal owner is. Now, you can't buy a title from a company; you can't download one from the internet; you have to get it from the government. The only way they can give you a new title is if you have the old one. There are a lot of little loopholes and backdoor methods people use to get titles, but a lot of times they can get you in trouble.

Let's take a look at an example of that. There are methods of getting a title that are sometimes not really that good because, when you use them, you can have your title revoked and you can get legal problems. There's a very famous auto restorer named Boyd Coddington. Now, this is an old article from 2004, 20 years ago, which is about how long we've been doing titles, by the way, since the early 2000s. The state of California filed charges against this person. Now, we're not casting doubt on them, but what this person was doing was that the attorney general's special crimes unit conducted an investigation into the fraudulent registration of replica vehicles. They were switching VIN numbers from one vehicle to another because these were constructed vehicles made out of parts of different cars. They were switching VIN numbers from one of the cars to another. All the above actions are felony because they were registering a vehicle whose value is misrepresented and avoiding compliance with smog laws.

So if you're using any title method that's trying to do some backdoor method to avoid taxes, avoid smog laws, avoid inspection, or even to change the identity of the vehicle, that's going to be a problem. It's not just California; that's going to be a problem anywhere. If you are getting a title, not only do you want to make sure that the method is good, but you also want to make sure you know what the method is. The reason we say that is because there are a lot of options you'll find out there on Craigslist, on Facebook, and online, where there'll be somebody who says, "Look, pay us money; we'll give you a title." If that company or person is not telling you exactly how they're doing it, then you might want to be suspicious because who knows if the method they're using is any good, if it's going to get you into trouble, or if the title can even get revoked?

What's an example of that? There was a company back about the same amount of time called Broadway Title. Now, again, this is from 2011. Word of caution: I purchased a vehicle, and I went through Broadway Title in Alabama. I had to return my plates and title to the state of Illinois after having them for two years because the method that this company, Broadway Title, used was illegal. It wasn't right. Now, I think Broadway Title, the name, has been sold to some other company, so I can't speak to whether this company is any good. This is just one person's opinion, but other people have said that their method of doing it was ridiculous, that they had to get a lawyer, and that the state didn't allow it. There's a lot of potential variables, so let's not jump too much onto the Broadway title. But what they were doing, according to other comments, and you can read this yourself on a very popular classic car vehicle website, is that you would sign the vehicle over to this company, they would get a title in their name, and then sign it over to you. Who knows what they were doing to get the title in their name, right? If they were doing something that was maybe not just illegal but borderline unethical, and if the state sees too many coming from this one company, they might crack down on them.

That's why the best way to do it is to not do something that's so opaque that you can't tell what the title method is. You want to know what it is. In fact, the way we do it is that we don't actually apply for the title. You want to be the one who applies for the title. If you let somebody else apply for the title, first of all, the title might not be in your name; it might be in somebody else's name, and you have to rely on them to give it to you. Number two, you won't know the method until you sign the form, which means that you're liable for some method that you didn't even know how it was done.

There's only two ways that the government really says you should be getting a title. Let's take a look at those. One is what's called the bonded title process. Most states, except for a few, have a bonded title process. If you do not have the proper paperwork to get a title, you can go through this bonding process and get a title. There are a couple of misconceptions. Some people think you have to pay thousands of dollars for a bond to do this. You have to buy a bond, but usually the bond costs you a couple hundred bucks. It's not that much. What you have to do is provide an explanation for requesting a bonded title. Basically, what they're asking you is, Why didn't you have the right paperwork? Are you in legal control of the vehicle? Are you in possession of the vehicle? If that's the case and you have an explanation and you buy a bond, as long as the vehicle is legitimate, not stolen, with no liens or claims against it, you pay a 15-dollar non-refundable fee. If you have any evidence of ownership, title, bill of sale, or canceled check, provide that as well. They'll take a look at it, and if everything looks okay and the state accepts bonds, you'll get a title.

That's the official suggested method that the states have. That's what you should look at first. Now, there's another method that you can use as a backup. We'll talk about the pros and cons of bonded titles in a minute. The other method is what's called a court order title. You can get more information about these on our website, cartitles.com. The other method is used in states that don't have a bonded title or if there's some reason that the bonded title doesn't work in your state. Here's an example of a court order title. This happens to be in Ohio. What are the steps? You have to visit a clerk to get the court order packet, which is this packet right here. You have to request the last known address of the vehicle by submitting the form to the BMV. It costs five bucks—no big deal. You have to mail a certified letter, get an inspection, and then file a petition. It says to appear before the judge, but normally you don't have to appear. Normally, you file the petition. If everything looks okay, they'll either give it to you, or sometimes they require you to come in front of the clerk to raise your right hand and swear under oath that this is true, and then you pick up your title.

It's a few steps; you have to jump through some hoops, but I have to tell you, it's a lot less than some of these other methods that people use. For example, there's the Vermont loophole. You'll see this on our website and online, and even major insurance companies like Hagerty Insurance and Car and Driver have written about this loophole method. You apply by mail to the state of Vermont, get a registration from Vermont (not a title), then bring that to your state to exchange for a title. There's more steps involved with that than just doing a bonded or court order, but a lot of people like to do it because they feel like they're being sneaky and getting over the DMV. You could do that; in most states, you're not going to have a problem. There are a few states where if you bring a Vermont registration, they're going to say, "We know about this deal; get out of here." Different times throughout the year, different years, some states will have more problems than others. As of right now, in June 2023, we know for a fact that in the state of Florida, if you walk in with a Vermont registration, they're probably going to tell you to get the heck out.

If you want to go through the hassle of going through Vermont to get a registration and a license plate, you can do that, but you're running the risk of your state not accepting it. That risk is totally on you. Plus, you have to pay sales tax to the state of Vermont, and you might think, "How much could it be?" It could be a lot because Vermont does not figure the tax on what you think the value is or your bill of sale; they figure it on what the highest book value they can find is unless you present evidence otherwise. The evidence has to be a book value, not a picture of the car in pieces or what you paid for it. They might use a lower book value than what they find, but it's only a book value. You can't just say, "Well, it's only worth 300 dollars because it's in parts." We've done other videos of why that's the case.

You can also sometimes file for a mechanic's lien. Some people think, "Well, my buddy has a repair shop; he'll file a mechanic's lien and get a title." Don't even bother. States all across the country are cracking down on mechanic's liens. Several title companies that were operating for the last few years are now out of business. A couple of them have been prosecuted criminally for filing fake mechanic's liens. Look, a mechanic's lien is designed for a repair shop that actually did work on a vehicle; somebody didn't pay the bill, and they auctioned it off to the highest bidder. It's not just giving it to somebody else. If that's not what happened, the DMVs are going to find out because they audit these and look to see if this repair shop is paying a hundred mechanic's liens a month but only reporting a small amount of sales tax. They know they're out there selling fake mechanic's liens for 500 bucks a piece. Be aware that, just like the article we saw at the beginning, your title can get revoked if you do it the wrong way.

Now, the two methods that are officially recommended, suggested, and required are bonded title and court order title. End of story. If you decide to do something else besides those two, you run the risk that it could be harder than those two, it could cost more money, it could get rejected, or it might not work. Make your choice accordingly. If you pick a method to try to get a title that's not a court order or bonded title, you may run into problems down the road. Sometimes it works, but you have to make sure that you're weighing the risk and the reward of which one you want to do.

The title landscape in 2023 is about the same as it was before, but it's much riskier to do something other than a bonded or court-order title. Look, we've been doing this for 20+ years, doing car title paperwork for people. Remember, you're not buying a title from a company; you're not getting a company to print you out or issue you a title. A title is a legal government document. The government has to give it to you. A company can help you get it, but you don't want to just hand it over to them and let them do everything because they may do something that's cheaper and easier for them to do because it makes them more profit, but it could put you in hot water.

Make sure you're aware of what the process is, that you read a description of what the process is, and that you pick the process that you are comfortable with and familiar with. Make sure you know what it is. Don't just click it and say access to whatever; just do it. Make sure you know what's going on because that title is being done in your name, on your behalf, and once you sign those forms and send them in, you're on the hook for whatever they are. Make sure that you're picking the right form. Look, car titles are a legal, official document; you don't want to mess around with them. Do yourself a favor and get either a court order or a bonded title. You might think by reading it, and we'll pull this back up again, that this is going to be difficult. What are the steps to get a court order title? Visit the clerk and request it. This isn't really seven steps; most of these steps are combined. This is actually less work than jumping through the hoops you have to for Vermont because, remember, when you do the Vermont loophole, you have to get the Vermont registration, then switch it to your state and switch over your insurance. There's a lot of steps there: get a VIN verification. It's really the same amount of work, and you run the risk of your state not accepting it, and you have to pay the tax, and it's just sketchy. You're better off going directly with the right method.

There may be some legitimate, realistic scenarios where the Vermont process is the best way to go. Look, many high-profile people have done it. Like I said, Car and Driver, Jalopnik, Hagerty Insurance—you'll see many, many articles. People all over the web have done this. But that doesn't mean, in your case, it's the best way to go. Do yourself a favor: look at the court order; look at the bond. Don't be afraid of the fact that it sounds like there's too much work and too much bureaucracy. In the long run, you'll be a lot more secure. You won't have to be looking over your shoulder waiting for the DMV to yank your title because you did something they didn't want you to do. If you have any questions, reach out to our website, cartitles.com. You can consult with a title agent, and we can help you understand any of the processes a little bit better.